Maybe.
As we continue our series (to quote Sproul, since we’re using his “Willing To Believe” material at the prison bible study), last night 
we looked at Romans 3:9-18 and Romans 8:7-8 as part of the study on the debate between Luther and Erasmus.
For six months I have trying to communicate the concept of man’s natural deadness in sin. Last night it seemed to finally kick in for a few of the guys. After getting them to see the contrast between the natural man (“the mind set on the flesh” in Romans 8) and the spiritual man (“the mind set on the Spirit”), I asked this question: “Can the natural man – whose mind is set on the flesh – do anything in and of himself to respond to God’s commands?” They – especially one guy – shook their heads to say, “no.”
Then I asked the one guy who was responding most vigorously this question:
“_________, when you go evangelize out there (the prison compound) what do you tell them?”
He says, “To repent and believe.”
I said, “Good answer. Now a minute ago you just nodded when I asked if that natural man you’re evangelizing can do anything positive in response to God’s commands. When you tell them to repent and believe, are you issuing a command from God?”
“Yes.”
“That command again was…what?”
“To repent and believe.”
“Good. But does that man have the ability to repent and believe?”
“No.”
“Then how can you ask him to repent and believe if he is incapable of doing it?”
Silence. Blank stare. He then scrunches up his face and says, “I don’t know.”
So I then asked the group (of about 20), “Why do we do command him (the natural man) to do something he is incapable of doing?”
More silence.
So I waited. (In sales, they tell you when you ask a “closing question,” you are to then become silent, because whoever speaks first “loses.” I was waiting for someone to speak first, and it sure appeared they didn’t want to give the right answer…)
After about 30 seconds, one of the guys in the second row says in a real low voice, “ye must be born again…” I said, “Say that louder so everyone can hear it.” He does it. I said, “Exactly.”
So to make the point I had one of the guys expound on Ezekiel 37 as a parallel example of what we are doing when we evangelize and WHY we have to evangelize that way.
It’s always a good thing when you see the light bulb go on in someone’s head. It appears quite a few bulbs went on last night. We shall see.
I’ve never used the phrase “Total Depravity” in describing this concept yet. I didn’t want to muddy the waters with a term that may cause consternation because of how we interpret the term instead of looking at the idea the term is meant to summarize. That’ll change this coming Sunday. The material moves on to John Calvin and specifically addresses the terms “Total Depravity” and “Unconditional Election” along with looking at John 6:44 and the word “draw.” It may well be big fun.
Hello,
Where does the idea that nobody can normally repent and believe come from? It can hardly be won by Romans, a text you are obviously using to argue for an inability to believe the gospel.
Romans 3:9-18 is part of the entire prelude used by Paul to introduce the good news, that begin at the turning point of verse 3:21. The quotation of the Psalm in Rom 3 is made with a certain purpose, namely the establishment of the new law of faith. In Romans chapter 1-3:20 Paul has been explaining why the old law was unsuitable to grant life. The old law simply wouldn’t und couldn’t be kept by anyone. Now the following is crucial: Paul refers to the failure of the old law to grant life as the reason for the necessity of the new law of faith. The entire introduction in the Letter to the Romans is aiming at the necessity of the gospel of grace. The ten commandments couldn’t be fulfilled by anybody, therefore God graciously bestowed something new. Now, it would be very far-fetched and even blatantly against common sense to hold that this new law cannot be kept any better than the old law. For what good would this substitution be? Why a gospel, if it doesn’t accomplish any more than the old law?
Paul’s entire derivation of the new covenant of faith is lapsed if we assume that faith is inhibited by human nature. Yes, the argumentation of Rom. 3:1-20 would have to be disregarded! And this is just what reformed doctrine does.
Yet Paul is drawing a distinction between the covenant that was thwarted by the flesh and the new covenant, which is beyond frustration by the human nature. There is a difference between the old and the new covenant with respect to their satisfiability. Yet this is actually what “Total Depravity” is saying, that the new covenant isn’t any more fulfillable than the old one!
This is why the reformed dogma that nobody can naturally believe the gospel is so far-fetched and unreasonable. Not to mention the absolute lack of scriptural evidence that explicitly supports this doctrine.
Furthermore, John 6:44 doesn’t in any way support the idea of man’s inability to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. It says that nobody can possibly come to the kingdom of God unless he is righteous (drawn by godly motives). Righteousness in the sight of God however, is by faith in the gospel.
“Total Depravity” is therefore mere human tradition.
Greetings
-a helmet
I don’t get it. In the above is the question:
“Then how can you ask him to repent and believe if he is incapable of doing it?”
Silence. Blank stare. He then scrunches up his face and says, “I don’t know.”
So I then asked the group (of about 20), “Why do we do command him (the natural man) to do something he is incapable of doing?”
And the answer comes:
“ye must be born again…” I said, “Say that louder so everyone can hear it.” He does it. I said, “Exactly.”
How does that answer the question? And isn’t that something that man is ‘capable’ of doing?
Jesus’ statement in John 3:7 (…ye must be born again.” KJV) is not a command but a statement of fact. Man cannot give birth to himself or do anything to cause the birth. As Jesus continues in John 3, that birth is in the hands of the Spirit (v.8) John also says the new birth is “of God” in John 1:12-13 and 1 John 5:1. The new birth is indeed a necessity for salvation, but we don’t do anything to initiate it – just like our natural birth – we are passive in the process.